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From Twitter 10-27-2010
Oct. 28th, 2010 03:10 am- 12:05:07: RT @pixel: The predicted cost of going to Mars: ~$145 Billion. The cost of the Iraq war so far: ~$739 Billion. Which one would you rath ...
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Oct. 28th, 2010
on men and women fencing
Oct. 28th, 2010 09:04 pm...and the discussion over at Fencing.net re: transsexuals and athletics:
For those unwilling to plow through the 25+(!) pages of commentary, I gather that a trans woman won one of the veteran women's epee events at the latest North American Cup, and some competitors feel this is very unfair. I dreaded where the commentary would go but apart from a few statements made more out of ignorance than transphobia, it's a fairly moderate conversation overall.
Most of the commenters seem to be working on 3 assumptions:
1) men and women fence differently,
2) the men's style is inherently better/more successful in competition (I don't see any comments from men worried about potentially fencing a trans man), so
3) a woman who used to be a man has an unfair advantage (even after surgery/hormone therapy) over women.
While I can see 1, I'm struggling with 2, and so don't agree with 3, and I'm reluctant to comment over at the forums as I'm a relative noob/small fish in the big pond of competitive fencing so I fear my speculations would get me roasted alive. But if you'll indulge my thinking aloud here:
( snipped to spare non-fencers )
So, my own conclusions, with the disclaimer that things may be different at the elite level and without extrapolating my own experience to anyone else: I don't really see the point in having the gender divisions anyway. If men and women do fence differently, well, doesn't it make one a better fencer to fence everyone available? (The age divisions still make sense to me, as everyone tends to lose reflexes/speed with age).
If there are still going to be men's and women's events, trans people should fence with the gender they chose to be. Any advantages/disadvantages will be evened out by other factors (age, fitness, training, smarts), and I suspect there are so few trans people competing in elite sports that any skewing of bell curves and the like will be negligible.
Opinions heartily welcomed, and if I've been insensitive to the trans community in any way, please let me know where my language or context has failed and I'll attempt to correct it.
For those unwilling to plow through the 25+(!) pages of commentary, I gather that a trans woman won one of the veteran women's epee events at the latest North American Cup, and some competitors feel this is very unfair. I dreaded where the commentary would go but apart from a few statements made more out of ignorance than transphobia, it's a fairly moderate conversation overall.
Most of the commenters seem to be working on 3 assumptions:
1) men and women fence differently,
2) the men's style is inherently better/more successful in competition (I don't see any comments from men worried about potentially fencing a trans man), so
3) a woman who used to be a man has an unfair advantage (even after surgery/hormone therapy) over women.
While I can see 1, I'm struggling with 2, and so don't agree with 3, and I'm reluctant to comment over at the forums as I'm a relative noob/small fish in the big pond of competitive fencing so I fear my speculations would get me roasted alive. But if you'll indulge my thinking aloud here:
( snipped to spare non-fencers )
So, my own conclusions, with the disclaimer that things may be different at the elite level and without extrapolating my own experience to anyone else: I don't really see the point in having the gender divisions anyway. If men and women do fence differently, well, doesn't it make one a better fencer to fence everyone available? (The age divisions still make sense to me, as everyone tends to lose reflexes/speed with age).
If there are still going to be men's and women's events, trans people should fence with the gender they chose to be. Any advantages/disadvantages will be evened out by other factors (age, fitness, training, smarts), and I suspect there are so few trans people competing in elite sports that any skewing of bell curves and the like will be negligible.
Opinions heartily welcomed, and if I've been insensitive to the trans community in any way, please let me know where my language or context has failed and I'll attempt to correct it.